Sugestion regarding piracy

[Licaon_Kter]

(09-16-2010 09:27 PM)SHODANFreeman Wrote:  So if someone buys on Steam or elsewhere, they're chopped liver?

this can be arranged between FG and Valve

[SHODANFreeman]

(09-16-2010 09:50 PM)kuato Wrote:  theres some kind of api for websites to check what steam games u got like garrysmod.org does

Couldn't anyone just register with any random person that owns the game's Steam id then?

[Jinix]

Lets say there are 10 pirates for every paid customer.
Then game makers should price their products accordingly.
Yes, the customer must pay the difference just like every other thing in life.
From insurance fraud to the cost of shoplifters - products have those costs factored in the price.
You won't stop piracy so to stay profitable you have work around that.

Frictional Games needs to follow the success of Fallout 3's downloadable content. They charge a bit for extra episodes and get it, in spite of the hundreds of free mods that are as much or more fun to play. Now make buyable addons. I'll buy more assets, scripts and models for the editor anytime. I'll pay more for that then I did the game. I'll buy updates to the editor too.

Don't worry about pirates - if Microsoft's software was never pirated they and computers in general would have barely caught on for the general public and certainly not in such short a time.
When software first came out it was pirated as a norm. The first computer stores always pre-installed 'copies' of retail software just to sell the computers.
Some of the most pirated were Autocad and Microsoft Word and Excel - all are billion dollar companies now. The ones that failed may cry piracy as a factor but it was more inferior products or not enough marketing savvy that got them - not pirates.

Piracy has always been around and all things are equal.
I'm betting that most of the sharers of pirated software wouldn't buy anyways. Most are too young and their parents would never buy it for them, or too broke to buy, so where is the real monetary loss? As long as the company can make enough to pay the investors a profit and give themselves a nice bonus plus wages what else should be necessary.

As long as it remains illegal and someone gets busted to show the severity of getting caught once in a while, it'll average out. There are enough honest people around that will not pirate and that's the market to be concerned about.

Eventually it'll be impossible to do anything 'wrong'. Every piece of data on every human will soon be in a data center that can catch you the moment you download something you shouldn't.

[superluser]

(09-16-2010 07:44 PM)Licaon_Kter Wrote:  

(09-16-2010 05:19 PM)superluser Wrote:  You can also make the counterargument that finding bugs in pirated copies helps make the paid copies more stable, as well. It's not a particularly strong argument, but it is an argument.

Ok, so why don't you make some game that you want to sell and me + my 10000 friends will find bugs for you, but you give us a free copy first, deal? Or better yet why not ask the FG devs why they did not do just that?

Funny. I'm looking forward to using the dev tools to do just that. I am not making this argument (because I think it is a weak argument) but others are taking up its torch. You will want to discuss this particular point with them, not me.

(09-16-2010 07:44 PM)Licaon_Kter Wrote:  

(09-16-2010 05:19 PM)superluser Wrote:  The chilling effect that comes when you have the cool forum members who have bought all Frictional's games, and then the social rejects who only liked Penumbra and decided not to go for Amnesia (or vice versa), and the fact that it is immediately identifiable which group someone is in at all times beside every message.

You keep pressing with this, i'll reiterate: I don't care if someone liked Penumbra but not Amnesia, or the other way around, if they did not pirate the game they can talk until their keyboards break. This has nothing to do anything, better yet, make that icon viewable only by moderators/devs, and new tech threads by pirates get silenced or don't get any dev attention ( until a valid key is aquired anyway ).

OK. Cool. I withdraw my chilling effect criticism.

(09-16-2010 07:44 PM)Licaon_Kter Wrote:  BTW, could you please read this: http://frictionalgames.blogspot.com/2010...nesia.html and then comment this there:

Quote:Dear FG devs, it does not matter that plenty of users did not buy the game and yet they play it, just think about all the FREE bug reports as well as solutions that could have otherwise cost you thousands of dollars just to solve for one customer with an unique problem.

I'm sure they'll be thrilled that you opened they eyes.

I have read that, and I see Frictional taking some time out to reflect on the pirates, exasperated that there were so many of them. What I do not see is a condemnation of pirates. It's a difficult line to walk--these people are future customers, and while you want to shout at them and tell them that what they are doing is wrong, these people now take a freeloader mentality and that sort of hard line attitude will just ensure that they never buy your game. It sucks, and it's an inherent paradox, but that's life.

[Licaon_Kter]

(09-17-2010 12:43 PM)superluser Wrote:  I have read that, and I see Frictional taking some time out to reflect on the pirates, exasperated that there were so many of them. What I do not see is a condemnation of pirates. It's a difficult line to walk--these people are future customers, and while you want to shout at them and tell them that what they are doing is wrong, these people now take a freeloader mentality and that sort of hard line attitude will just ensure that they never buy your game. It sucks, and it's an inherent paradox, but that's life.

I know, but when i read "sales going down, game pirated, might need to rise price & drop Linux/Mac versions & go to console" I get angry knowing that i bought the game to support this (Linux/Mac) game dev.

[iTIMMEH]

(09-17-2010 08:21 PM)Licaon_Kter Wrote:  I know, but when i read "sales going down, game pirated, might need to rise price & drop Linux/Mac versions & go to console" I get angry knowing that i bought the game to support this (Linux/Mac) game dev.

People need to stop looking at piracy as a sea of lost sales, sure there are some lost sales but most cases fall into one or more of the following:

• Hardcore Freeloaders/opportunists
• People curious but not enough to make a purchase
• People unable to purchase
  

In the majority of cases removing the pirated version will convert these downloads into... nothing.

Hardcore freeloaders and opportunists will just pirate something else, people mildly curious will pass the title by and those unable to buy due to finances or regional restrictions still won't be buying anything.

[Zanderat]

(09-17-2010 10:14 PM)iTIMMEH Wrote:  

(09-17-2010 08:21 PM)Licaon_Kter Wrote:  I know, but when i read "sales going down, game pirated, might need to rise price & drop Linux/Mac versions & go to console" I get angry knowing that i bought the game to support this (Linux/Mac) game dev.

People need to stop looking at piracy as a sea of lost sales, sure there are some lost sales but most cases fall into one or more of the following:

• Hardcore Freeloaders/opportunists
• People curious but not enough to make a purchase
• People unable to purchase
  

In the majority of cases removing the pirated version will convert these downloads into... nothing.

Hardcore freeloaders and opportunists will just pirate something else, people mildly curious will pass the title by and those unable to buy due to finances or regional restrictions still won't be buying anything.

In the the other pirate thread you rationalize theft as well. How many games have you stolen?

[kuato]

ive stolen shitloads of games. but i bough penumbra twice so get off my back!!!

---

i wouldnt pirate a game like amnesia from a small indie dev but giving money to any big media type company is almost definitely more harmful and immoral than pirating an i avoid it whenever i can.

[iTIMMEH]

(09-18-2010 04:45 AM)Zanderat Wrote:  In the the other pirate thread you rationalize theft as well. How many games have you stolen?

Grow up.

[Jinix]

Pirating my be the only way to play for Kids with no credit cards or students who are broke.
It's imperative that the assumed losses are included when pricing the package.
Just make a game where you have to log in to Frictional Games where it's checked against bought copies before it plays.
Altho' I can't quite see how it affects sales, unless you had every intention and a credit card ready to buy, when a shady fellow with a parrot on his shoulder diverts you away.
And naturally after getting a bootlegged copy some of those will end up here asking questions and taking part in the fun without paying their $20.
So maybe tie in membership to the forum with the games serial numbers or registration number.

Stealing in any form is really nothing to condone regardless of the victim - a thief by his very nature cannot be trusted and will eventually land up with only other thieves for friends, which may sound very romantic but always comes to a sticky end.

If one really wants a $20 game it cannot be that hard to find the dough or if you are a kid at home you could do a few chores for it. Just don't tell Mom what the game is about.