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Spoiler Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*
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bluel0bster Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

(09-11-2013 12:50 AM)General Consensus Wrote:  It was the August 30th 1899 letter, about the receiving of a crate with a body inside. Oswald describes "It is humanoid in shape, but has suffered severe skeletal deformity. Remnants of leather straps encase the torso, which is deformed, with evidence of muscle mass and displacement."

Pretty sure it was referring to one of the pigmen, grunts weren't especially muscular.

As far as references to the first game, the most obvious is the Compound X stuff. A letter specifically mentions it being made of, "Brennenburg Infusion (or something like that) Vitae" and some other compound. Also, the reference to an "Orb" (with a capital 'O' interestingly) is a big one.

Also, I may have found the Brennenburg coat of arms. Probably wishful thinking, but this just seemed a little too out of place. I'm curious if anybody can confirm this to actually be a connection to Brennenburg:
Spoiler below!

[Image: BA5826D5F104A18A48CD5729CCB63FCDC7B0BA2C]

(This post was last modified: 09-11-2013 02:45 AM by bluel0bster.)
09-11-2013 02:36 AM
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Vertical Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

(09-11-2013 02:28 AM)Derxor Wrote:  So why did the lights allways flicker when a monster is near?
Spoiler below!

Does it have anything to do with the final electrical-pig boss?


Spoiler below!
It propably has more to do with the Compound X, which was used to bond tissues.

Quoting one note:
Quote:July 15th 1899

In order to facilitate assimilation of tissue groups, a compound is required, or the cells will not bond. Disposal of non-bonded subjects must be immediate and using incineration or we risk continuous animation without form. This is... unpleasant.

A simple compound of one part Brennenburg Infusion Vitae to one part Orgone Monad Disperal fluid is sufficient. This can then be administered intravenously to subjects following re-assembly to maintain bonding. The compound is unstable and highly light reactive - once in the body, the Schumann Lamp can be used to activate the compound, but outside the body is highly corrosive. It can even destroy small quantities of metal.

(This post was last modified: 09-11-2013 02:48 AM by Vertical.)
09-11-2013 02:47 AM
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bluel0bster Offline
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Post: #13
RE: Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

So... what about that attack on London scene? That's what people should be talking about, that was some crazy stuff. Didn't see that coming at all. Really got my adrenaline going. Too bad technical limitations forced the majority of the action to take place off-screen, but still.
09-11-2013 03:27 AM
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Alex Ros Offline
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Post: #14
RE: Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

As far as I progressed, I presume I am around half through, I would say quite for sure...

1. Oswald is a nephew of the Brennenburg Alexander.
2. Oswald Mandus was a usual butcher.
3. Oswald was married with beloved Liliane and they had twins children. Sometimes before 1898.
4. At some point after the death of beloved wife Oswald decided to build a machine for... for what? I am not sure at the moment. At first I presume Oswald did want to build a great machine to feed the whole mankind. Automated butchery.
5. While Brennenburg castle was destroyed some notes were found and some of them described a treasure hidden at some chamber in Mexican pyramid. Oswald decided to find that treasure. As long as he could not get a credit from a bank to build a machine.
6. Oswald found Orb. Sadly both of his children were traveling with him, so Shadow is seeking for them too. And that's the turning point when Oswald decides to twist his butchery machine into butchery vitae machine in order to save his children.
7. Quickly Oswald realized pigs slaughtering is not enough to stop the Shadow. He began to collect beggars and whores.
8. At the same time orphans children were cleaning the tubes of the machine. The process was extremely dangerous as long as if an orphan would not leave a tube in time he would be boiled alive by steam.
9. In fact Oswald did hate high class people, not beggars or whores. So from time to time he arranged parties, but at the morning guests woke up in barred bed-cells and those bed-cells were connected to the machine conveyor somehow. Yup, one of those beds where the game begins.
10. Some of the prisoners of Oswald knew that there were an escape route through the tubes. Orphan children found that secret way. And what is more interesting, seems like Oswalds children occasionally got boiled and died at those tubes. That's a twist! Oswald have build a machine to save his children from Shadow, but they both died inside that machine.

That's all for now. I just got to the sewers. I hope later it would become clear who are those pig-monsters.

11. I know already that Oswald found brute body and realized that a dead body can be mutilated-twisted into servants. Also I know that Oswald tried to resurrect poisoned dog and decided it's better to make subjects drown in the water. But... Still I do not have a clue what is this exactly that interested Oswald in resurrecting. He knows that he can't resurrect his wife. So? So what? I do not know. Maybe, I just presume, he wants to make a better man. Not a robot, not a machine, not a soulless brute, but a perfect creature. Maybe, I do not know for sure.

Well, that's surely all for now on. It's not so much complicated and confusing, I mean the story, if you will read documents in a chronological order, not in order of finding them.
(This post was last modified: 09-11-2013 04:17 AM by Alex Ros.)
09-11-2013 04:07 AM
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Streetboat Offline
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Post: #15
RE: Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

The story was very bioshock infinite-esque. Oswald was driven mad by the death of his wife as she gave birth to his twin children, and his personality was split between a driving desire to destroy all of mankind and to also feed mankind. This allowed him to build the machine (with the help of the Orb, I believe), and an amnesia of sorts was induced on him (hence him being both the saboteur and the savior of the machine) at the beginning of the game. He was unwittingly activating the machine that he had both built and sabotaged, and was now repurposing again. In the end, he brought about the downfall of London, and upon seeing this, was brought to his senses and went back down and destroyed it all by killing himself. He was a manifestation of himself.

I find it funny that everyone is confused by TCR removing the insanity meter, when in reality, they never did, they just made it more pervasive. The character you play as is completely insane; the voices you hear are supposedly played over speakers in the facility, but no, that is your alternate personality (dubbed "the machine" in the voice acting credits) speaking within yourself. This also explains why you would have "flashbacks" like in the first Amnesia game. You are remembering your own personal memories of building and activating the machine for pigs. Your intentions for the machine, however, changed once the evil personality was made aware of its potential for wiping out humanity.

That's what I gathered from the story. It's a solid narrative because it keeps you guessing until the end. I knew the kids were dead from the beginning, but I only had an inkling that Mandus killed them himself. Supposedly, he did it in an effort to save them from witnessing the horrifying things he had witnessed humanity was capable of. Fairly misguided, if you ask me, further shows how insane he was.

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09-11-2013 04:33 AM
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Alardem Offline
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Post: #16
RE: Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

Very poignantly, he's driven mad by the industrial horrors of the 20th century - allusions to World War I, the Russian Revolution and the subsequent Communist party, the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, and a 'house of skulls in the jungle' (Vietnam war? The Khmer Rouge of Cambodia?)
09-11-2013 05:20 AM
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MyRedNeptune Offline
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Post: #17
RE: Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

@Streetboat Pretty much my impression of the plot. I'm very certain that the voice is an alternate personality, not an actual person speaking, and it's pretty obvious if you look at all the clues/suggestions in the game.

^(;,;)^
09-11-2013 05:29 AM
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Marche100 Offline
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Post: #18
RE: Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

Wow, I think that Streetboat pretty well has it. I certainly couldn't have tried to explain it any better than that.

(09-11-2013 03:27 AM)bluel0bster Wrote:  So... what about that attack on London scene? That's what people should be talking about, that was some crazy stuff. Didn't see that coming at all. Really got my adrenaline going. Too bad technical limitations forced the majority of the action to take place off-screen, but still.

Yeah, that scene was absolutely exhilarating. Didn't see it coming. Mandus' alternate personality taunting him was great for the adrenaline. And all the pigs. THE PIGS!!! Best part of the whole game, in my opinion.

My only regret is that I won't be able to experience it for the first time twice, although it will certainly be exciting the second time 'round, too, I'm sure.
09-11-2013 05:42 AM
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Alardem Offline
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Post: #19
RE: Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

(09-11-2013 05:42 AM)Marche100 Wrote:  Wow, I think that Streetboat pretty well has it. I certainly couldn't have tried to explain it any better than that.

(09-11-2013 03:27 AM)bluel0bster Wrote:  So... what about that attack on London scene? That's what people should be talking about, that was some crazy stuff. Didn't see that coming at all. Really got my adrenaline going. Too bad technical limitations forced the majority of the action to take place off-screen, but still.

Yeah, that scene was absolutely exhilarating. Didn't see it coming. Mandus' alternate personality taunting him was great for the adrenaline. And all the pigs. THE PIGS!!! Best part of the whole game, in my opinion.

My only regret is that I won't be able to experience it for the first time twice, although it will certainly be exciting the second time 'round, too, I'm sure.

I liked how Mors Praematura was used there.

Where do you reckon all those screams Frictional wanted back in Halloween were placed? During the London attack, or during your final ascent to the Machine?

Also, I ended up thinking that the 'Machine' is actually an ancient presence that Mandus wound up excavating. Some eldritch horror beneath his factory, "the skinless one awakening", just like how Brennenburg appears to have been built over far older ruins...
(This post was last modified: 09-11-2013 07:04 AM by Alardem.)
09-11-2013 06:11 AM
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zepelius Offline
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Post: #20
RE: Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

I didn't quite get what's this "Egg" which is mentioned many times during game. Is it just another orb which Mandus found in Mexico?
09-11-2013 07:08 AM
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