thats not a bad idea Rapture. indeed, you should get the lantern early on, seeing as the "flashlight" was brand spanking new technology in the time AMFP is set in, so indeed, it should be a rare item that isnt found until some way into the game..
how about the player has 2 types of lantern, the old "Hurricane lamp" type from amnesia that gets lost early on, and the Gas Jet type (wich were more prevailant in victorian english factories) later in the game.
the problem with forcing the player to loose equipment is, its only scary once, if its done too often, it can make the game feel artificial, its one of the things that sadly really lets "deadlight" down (great potential, but, sadly, let down by some very bad decisions that lower it from "potential masterpeice" to "not a bad little xbla game"), you loose your equipment too many times, the first time it happens, it is Scary! the second time it feels forced, and on the third instance, it feels like "treyarchisinfinitywarditus", otherwise known as "incompetant developers disease", sometimes called "bad programming!" (thankyou Ben "yahtzee" Crosshaw!). so yes, i agree the player should loose Everything at the midpoint of the game, it should only happen the once, so it feels like a scare mechanic and not lazy design.
@Hirnwirbel. Lols. im with you there, i could rant enough against how awfull QTE is alone to fill a whole thread.
yes, i do see what you mean, it can open up so many vulnerabilities that it could make the game totally unplayable, although i myself would be fascinated to play a horror game with a totally vulnerable charachter, as id be able to relate to that charachter, increasing the immersion and fear factor, i quess AMFP is not the game for that mechanic. indeed it is a very slippery slope, seeing as Crystal Dynamics have implimented that slippery slope (injuries, sprains, falls, etc) into the new tomb raider, it will be very interesting, i think, to see how that turns out.
yes, i can think of many players who would mess up and chop the charachters fungers off on purpose for the "lols factor" im one of them! indeed, that was a bit of a bad idea...
indeed, that sounds good, gives a nice realistic impression of focuss (maybe blur out the periphial surroundings as he focuses to replicate the eyes "feild of focus") and still makes the player vulnerable without feeling artificial, great idea.
Quote: [...]although i myself would be fascinated to play a horror game with a totally vulnerable charachter, as id be able to relate to that charachter[...]
Oh that reminds me - have you ever played "the Void"? It's not really a horror game, more of a surreal-creepy-artsy-game but its very dark, atmospheric and unique. In that game you only have one resource and its at the same time your lifeforce(quite literally!), your weapon and the only way to interact with NPCs and the environment.
Combined with the scary, dark world it is set in it really feels as if everything you do only serves to drag you closer to death - which makes sense story-wise as the game is set in a world between life and death. It really excels at making you feel incredibly vulnerable and alone - at times you even get the feeling the game itself doesn't want you to win...
Quote: so yes, i agree the player should loose Everything at the midpoint of the game, it should only happen the once, so it feels like a scare mechanic and not lazy design.
Sounds good - but how should it be implemented? I have the feeling, thechineseroom will try and stay away from cutscenes (and rightfully so!) in favor of more interactive storytelling. And the ol' bump-on-the-head-wake-up-in-a-cell-later-without-your-stuff thingy has been done too often I think...
Maybe the game could simply have a part where the player needs to dive through water and as a result the lamp doesn't work anymore afterwards. That could be very scary, too - imagine if you could only see blurry there (as it should be) and while your head is underwater you hear faint sounds you couldn't hear above the surface. Deep moaning, more felt than heard, clicking and cracking, the sound of something huge slowly closing in on you from below...but you have to dive down into that black abyss nonetheless, not knowing what will await you there.
Which REMINDS me - why aren't there more horror games taking place in the deep sea? One would think it would be a no-brainer, especially if you take Lovecraft as inspiration...
No Hirnwirbel, i havnt played "the void" i am afraid, it sounds brilliant though, atmospheric and challenging, ill definatly get searching for it (age is no issue, as ive got a Dual OS on this (xp 32 and win 7 64, switchable) sounds like id really enjoy it, thanks for the suggestion my freind.
indeed, "bump on the head" is now a total cliche, its never worked well either as its such a contrived bit of writing, the only time it has worked is NOLF, were it was treated with humour.
yes, the chinese room will almost certainly stay away from cutscenes, wich is good, seeing as the player needs to feel the horror is happening to them in a horror game, so, the game has to stay in first person, and "first person" cutscenes are about the Cheapest and most boring game mechanic Infinity ward has ever cursed us with. so i agree, Interactive storytelling in the style of "Dear Esther" is the perfect way to go with horror, Cutscenes only really belong in shooters and RPG, and even there they Really need to be third person as then you can tell the "villains" side of the story and the "backroom support" side, not just the protragonists, wich really cheapens the story and limits the scope, it can even make the story fail to make sense.
speaking of chinese room, i hope Nigel Carrington is doing some VO for AMFP, i can listen to him all day!
i like your underwater idea, indeed, water incursion would ruin all of your supplies, forcing the player to dump them as useless, and indeed, as AMFP is set in the Victorian times, were factories were powered by Giagantic Newcome And Watt Beam type Steam Engines, there would be need to be a giant resevoir fed by a river at some point, to slake the unending thirst of the gigantic boilers that make the steam for the pig machine. so its a very logical and realistic inclusion.
indeed, underwater sections, in the games they are in, are always tense, as you cant see much, and sound is both amplified, but also heavilly distorted, it is the perfect environment for Horror. remember how tense the sunken frighter was in NOLF, all the creaking metal and the sound of the sharks swimming around looking for a Cate Archer flavoured Snack? that level had a proper scary atmosphere, and its not even a horror game, (although its nowhere near as scary as "ice station evil" in Nolf 2, that one is a full bore horror level!) so, if a non horror game can be made pretty creepy by having an undwater segment, an underwater segment in a proper full blown horror game would probably sent the old heart rate absolutly Stratospheric.
i dont know why there arnt many Underwater Horrors, i think there was one on the original Playstation..but im sad to say its name escapes my right now, as indeed, underwater is a perfect horror environment, and ideed, Lovecraft was rather fond of "terror from the deep" style stories himself.
we need more underwater segments in games, and thats all genres.
(08-08-2012, 07:22 PM)the dark side Wrote: [ -> ]No Hirnwirbel, i havnt played "the void" i am afraid, it sounds brilliant though, atmospheric and challenging, ill definatly get searching for it (age is no issue, as ive got a Dual OS on this (xp 32 and win 7 64, switchable) sounds like id really enjoy it, thanks for the suggestion my freind.
indeed, "bump on the head" is now a total cliche, its never worked well either as its such a contrived bit of writing, the only time it has worked is NOLF, were it was treated with humour.
yes, the chinese room will almost certainly stay away from cutscenes, wich is good, seeing as the player needs to feel the horror is happening to them in a horror game, so, the game has to stay in first person, and "first person" cutscenes are about the Cheapest and most boring game mechanic Infinity ward has ever cursed us with. so i agree, Interactive storytelling in the style of "Dear Esther" is the perfect way to go with horror, Cutscenes only really belong in shooters and RPG, and even there they Really need to be third person as then you can tell the "villains" side of the story and the "backroom support" side, not just the protragonists, wich really cheapens the story and limits the scope, it can even make the story fail to make sense.
speaking of chinese room, i hope Nigel Carrington is doing some VO for AMFP, i can listen to him all day!
i like your underwater idea, indeed, water incursion would ruin all of your supplies, forcing the player to dump them as useless, and indeed, as AMFP is set in the Victorian times, were factories were powered by Giagantic Newcome And Watt Beam type Steam Engines, there would be need to be a giant resevoir fed by a river at some point, to slake the unending thirst of the gigantic boilers that make the steam for the pig machine. so its a very logical and realistic inclusion.
indeed, underwater sections, in the games they are in, are always tense, as you cant see much, and sound is both amplified, but also heavilly distorted, it is the perfect environment for Horror. remember how tense the sunken frighter was in NOLF, all the creaking metal and the sound of the sharks swimming around looking for a Cate Archer flavoured Snack? that level had a proper scary atmosphere, and its not even a horror game, (although its nowhere near as scary as "ice station evil" in Nolf 2, that one is a full bore horror level!) so, if a non horror game can be made pretty creepy by having an undwater segment, an underwater segment in a proper full blown horror game would probably sent the old heart rate absolutly Stratospheric.
i dont know why there arnt many Underwater Horrors, i think there was one on the original Playstation..but im sad to say its name escapes my right now, as indeed, underwater is a perfect horror environment, and ideed, Lovecraft was rather fond of "terror from the deep" style stories himself.
we need more underwater segments in games, and thats all genres.
Oh yes... do you remember that leaked concept art picture?(can't post it here)
Don't tell Traggey!
Well the only underwater horror game I can think of is this one:
Deep Sea It doesn't really count though, because it requires wearing a special gasmask and can only be played on festivals, exhibitions etc. But I find it very interesting how it creates fear by completely blinding the player, forcing him to depend on his hearing alone.
This would be an interesting thing to implement, too, right after the player loses his lamp and before he finds a new one. Only problem is, you would completely lose orientation and you coudn't even tell if you were walking against a wall because there's no feedback for that. So I guess it would only work if you had a huge hall or something like that...and you were walking towards a sound source maybe?
Or just make it so that it doesn't really matter where you go: Like you're in a huge room with electric lights that suddenly go out. And you're left to stumble around in the darkness for two minutes before the lights come back on - of course while being terrorized by awful sounds that make you feel like you should try and run away from them...naaah, I don't know, it probably wouldn't work very well.
Edit: Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! *fansqueal*
i remember the picture (dont shoot me mods!)
oh jeez, i could never play that "deep sea" one, i H-A-T-E having Anything touch my face! (its an autism thing) sounds bloomin scary though!
well, i did say the game should have near-total darkness segments, if you forget to charge the gas jets fuel pressure and the flashlight is broken. having total darkness wouldnt work, as the player would just keep slamming into walls, it would be more frustrating than scary.
what would work, i think, is "near total" darkness, say there is still one, small, faint lightsource, say light filtering through an air system grille, wich means you can just about see the outlines of items in the room at very close range, but they are very heavilly distorted, with the howls and screams eminating around the factory, combined with the whooshing of steam and the hearbeat like thumping of the steam engines, it would totally terrify the player, "is that black outline a Table or a monster?" youd be scared to even move because by the time you see the outline, two more steps and youll be in the monsters strike range, if it is one, it will be up to the player to discern via the sounds if the outline is machine or scenery by seeing how close the monster sounds are. sort of an "audio puzzle". I think that would work. of course, once you reach that little light source, youll have just enough light to repump the lamp, but in the equipmentless section, that would be properly scary i think.
err...what is with the fansqueal? (confused!)
Trolls, there is no leaked concept art picture
Yeah I don't think I could play that either. Especially since the mask is designed specifically so it's very hard for you to breathe with it - and the thought of drowning or suffocating is just unbearable for me.
Having almost no light would be the best solution, yes. It would be a bit like playing slender without the flashlight - you just start to see all kinds of things in the darkness. Also the loud noise of the machinery could make it much harder to hear from where an enemy is coming thus adding to the tension. (In quieter parts of the game you can just hide and wait for the enemy sounds to disappear)
I'd also like to see the concept of enemies carrying a lightsource make a reappearance in one way or an other. That really freaked me out in Black Plague, because you could never be sure if your dark hiding spot would be flooded with light the next moment. So imagine a dark room and the terrible, huge, walking piggymachine that's searching for you is powered by hot coals in its metal belly that give off a faint, red glow and throw bizarre shadows on the walls whenever the creature moves. It's hissing steam and the air bends from the heat and because the lightsource is under the monster you still can't really see what it looks like, only rimlights on its twisted anatomy.
The fansqueal referred to the spoiler above. Because I just had to spoil the fun for me and click on it. I'm stupid like that...