Amnesia: A Machine For Pigs Discussion Topic Part 1

[Gasjockey]

Frictional Games is not making games to get some extra bucks. They are not EA!
They make games because they love it and they wanted to present us some good stuff.
They also don't need extra bucks for their next title. They earned enough money with TDD.
When you remember, they have created Penumbra without any bucks.
Games are expensive, but it's possible to work efficient. The money doesn't have any influence on the quality of the game. The only thing what is important are the devs itself.

I know, after Amnesia was successful, they will have greater expectations with the next title. But it's not a must, that they will have it. You can not always be more successful every time than before, you also can make a lost. But I think, they earn more money than a normal worker and that's enough to make games. I mean, games like Penumbra, without any budget, should be sufficient.

Money has lots of influence on the game, especially when it's a proper game being worked on fulltime. One of the main things that held Amnesia back was just that, a lack of money and time. While it is true that a studio without money can create amazing games, they will often have to work in their free time, using nonoptimal tools and software, and have to rely on an external publisher that could possibly restrict their creativity and/or refrain from releasing the game on the grounds that it "wouldn't sell enough". While it would be very nice if money weren't an issue, the reality for now is that it is. Besides, it's not like anyone's complaining, is it? Another Amnesia game, even if not developed by Frictional, is a good thing. Also, success is not measured in coin. Success is how well you've reached your goals, so unless your only goal is to earn money (for some weird reason, I don't think that's the case with FG) money does not shape up as a form of quantification. Just making it clear for you.

[Googolplex]

This is not really negative or cynical, it's how business work and I'm sure Frictional Games know that as well (otherwise they would not be running a company)

Right, but they also were a company during the development of Penumbra.

And what I want to say is, that you can't demand to get more and more money always than before.

When you follow this strategy, you will end like EA did, in action games for big mass teenagers and console gamerz. Then you will lose all your art and the games will getting worse.

In the end, you have a big depraved mass who is buying games, games what aren't good anymore. But all the teenagers will like it and they will enjoy it to smash up monsters each other with their thousands of facebook friends in co-op mode.

This would make Frictional Games successful, but this crappy style of a game would destroy their rank as heroes.

This is exactly what EA has become.

This would be the end of legendary Frictional masterpieces and I think, they never would be able to work on such artless level.



You must not be a company only to get a fast bucket.

As you can see, Penumbra & Amnesia are fantastic, and they don't need a big budget to create it.



Frictional Games are just heroes. The games industry really needs more developers like them. Oriented to create good games and not only to get the most money.

[eliasfrost]

@Googolplex:

Just because a gaming company is partially driven to make money (which actually the point of having a company) doesn't mean that they are going blind and spit out near clones of the same game for decades, I think you are taking things too far.

I'm going to use myself as an example: I'm a musician and a concept artist, I absolutely love what I do and love to share my talent with other people and spread joy with my craft. But if I had the chance to, I'd make money on it. That doesn't mean I'm shallow, it doesn't mean I automatically become a soulless businessman, I just want to make a buck so that I have the chance to further develop my craft and that costs money, because it requires expensive equipment just like game development does.

I'm not saying Frictional's absolute goal is to make as much money as possible with shallow titles but at times making quick money will be a priority. And if that means hiring another game development team to give them a helping hand then I think they are smart, strategic and they know what they are doing.

Penumbra and Amnesia didn't have a big budget that's for sure but as you may or may not know, as a company grows, it naturally need more money to keep running, and Frictional has been hiring additional staff members as of late that costs money.

And as far as I know their revenue is mostly based on title sales, that means that they need to keep people interested to buy their stuff (their famous steam sales is a part of making good money, and it works). Since Amnesia is at least two years old, they need something new to fill in the gap between TDD and the new title they are working on, and MFP is a great way to fill the gap, keep people interested, deliver another good game and bring in some extra bucks, with the help of another recently heavily exposed team, which is good for publicity.

That said, I can without a doubt assume that MFP is partly made to get more money and more people to discover Frictional Games (TCR fans for example). That does not mean that they are not going to deliver a good game, it's just not the 100% sole purpose of the development and release of MFP.

Thanks.

[Googolplex]

We both have right in our arguments. I totally agree with you.

But what I think in short is, that their first goal is not to make the most of money. I think, their first goal is to make a good game (and when it will be less successfull than a football soccer game).

A company don't need to grow up permanently, they also can stay as they are and make games as they always did.


And I think, there are more copies sold through the Frictional Games store than through Steam. Because there are many people who doesn't like steam and want an offline installation without an account obligation to the game of lifetime. So I think, the people who find steam is cool will buy games via steam. But it will only work, if steam is an optional choice and not a commitment.
If Amnesia would be only for Steam, I'm sure, the people who would buy the game via Frictional Games Store will even pirate this game and in the internet are many of cracked steamless versions.


I'm one of the guys who will never buy a game for what you need steam to play.

But before you call me a troll, we all know, Steam is 100% cool.
Because you can chat with friends when you play Amnesia - yes it's so immersing!

[RawkBandMan]

But before you call me a troll, we all know, Steam is 100% cool.
Because you can chat with friends when you play Amnesia - yes it's so immersing!

You can appear offline in Steam, which disables your friends abilities to talk to you.

And in non-steam versions, you could just use Skype as an equivalent to Steam chat, so it's not much different.\

Not trying to start an argument or anything, lol. Just saying that.

[eliasfrost]

A company don't need to grow up permanently, they also can stay as they are and make games as they always did.

That may be true in very rare cases but it's not the case with Frictional, they have grown and that's a fact. I don't know how this is relevant.

And I think, there are more copies sold through the Frictional Games
store than through Steam. Because there are many people who doesn't like
steam and want an offline installation without an account obligation to
the game of lifetime. So I think, the people who find steam is cool
will buy games via steam. But it will only work, if steam is an optional
choice and not a commitment.

If Amnesia would be only for Steam, I'm sure, the people who would buy
the game via Frictional Games Store will even pirate this game and in
the internet are many of cracked steamless versions.

You are just assuming this, Frictional themselves said that the steam discounts are one of the reasons their sales got through the roof, especially the first year. This made Amnesia go to the top list in steam which made it visible to more people browsing the steam store, which increases possible sales. Also, it doesn't matter whether it's steam only or it's sold through a normal store, people are still gonna pirate the game, because (as opposed to common belief) pirates don't care about DRM and they never have, pirates were around even before the big DRM systems got into the business.

I believed it was because of the DRM at first too but then I did some research and found out that it doesn't matter whether you have serial key, steam activation, internet activation/connection check, they don't care about that, they are just lazy and don't want to pay money for games, it's really that simple.

I'm one of the guys who will never buy a game for what you need steam to play.

But before you call me a troll, we all know, Steam is 100% cool.
Because you can chat with friends when you play Amnesia - yes it's so immersing!

I used to dislike steam but nowadays I don't have a problem with it, I actually think it's a pretty nice way to keep my games organized and easily accessible.

[Arvuti]

And I think, there are more copies sold through the Frictional Games store than through Steam. Because there are many people who doesn't like steam and want an offline installation without an account obligation to the game of lifetime. So I think, the people who find steam is cool will buy games via steam. But it will only work, if steam is an optional choice and not a commitment.
If Amnesia would be only for Steam, I'm sure, the people who would buy the game via Frictional Games Store will even pirate this game and in the internet are many of cracked steamless versions.

there are more than 30 million users on steam and you are saying that more people bought amnesia from some indie developers site instead from the most successful digital distribution service ever.

[Traggey]

I... I just... I-I.... Wow...

[Gasjockey]

Googolplex, why do you do this to yourself? Do you enjoy arguing over stupid things? I've yet to see a post by you where you don't either state your opinions as facts, say something extremely narrowminded, or pull some statistics out of your ass to back up your faulty claims. Often several of these at the same time. Please, I say this for your own good, stop.

[Googolplex]

there are more than 30 million users on steam and you are saying that more people bought amnesia from some indie developers site instead from the most successful digital distribution service ever.

There are 30 million users on Steam, but are they freely there or were they forced to?

DRM does not work. The piracy was growing up when DRM was released.
DRM only annoy the honest buyer and destroy the fun with the game. So many people don't accept an obligation to internet activation and will pirate the game. And I have to say, that's the correct act. Because DRM protection is not acceptable!
When I want to read a book, then I take it out of the shelf and read it. I don't need to ask the publisher to permission. And I don't need to register this book online with my persona data account.
When the honest buyer is forced to use Steam to play the game, then I see no illegal to support piracy.
I always want to buy games, but I don't accept Steam or other DRM methods.
And many other people think so.

What is the next act? To make games for consoles only? To join the big mass publishing industry for casual gamerz like EA did? This would be the end of epic gaming!

Not connect this arguments to Frictional Games, this just is a general topic.